Project: '78 Vette
by DaSwish
Yeah, my car needs work, and I know it..
I had disliked how my car's rims had the black paint detailing that kept chipping off. Here's a pic of one of my rims that shows how the black paint is chipping away. This is actually one of the better wheel.. but still:
Using a piece of sandpaper and a cotter pin remover, I've been working on removing all of the black paint, so that I can eventually clean the wheels up and repaint them using the special heat-resistant paint, which should prevent future chipping. I worked on it this afternoon and as of right now, I have 1 wheel that's had the paint completely removed, and 2 that are about 75% finished. The fourth, I haven't gotten to yet. Here's a pic of the one that's finished completely:
So, I'll be finishin up this mini-project this week, and for Car Weekend, they'll just be paint-free. Then afterwards, I'll have to get in to cleaning and repainting.
I had disliked how my car's rims had the black paint detailing that kept chipping off. Here's a pic of one of my rims that shows how the black paint is chipping away. This is actually one of the better wheel.. but still:
Using a piece of sandpaper and a cotter pin remover, I've been working on removing all of the black paint, so that I can eventually clean the wheels up and repaint them using the special heat-resistant paint, which should prevent future chipping. I worked on it this afternoon and as of right now, I have 1 wheel that's had the paint completely removed, and 2 that are about 75% finished. The fourth, I haven't gotten to yet. Here's a pic of the one that's finished completely:
So, I'll be finishin up this mini-project this week, and for Car Weekend, they'll just be paint-free. Then afterwards, I'll have to get in to cleaning and repainting.
-THE SURGEON GENERAL WARNING NEVER SAID ANYTHING ABOUT SMOKING A FORD
Dont you just love the small projects. They are easy to do but make such a huge difference. That shit will look good when you are done Kenny.
Jeremy
Jeremy
Bringing this back from the dead:
Ok, so here's some stuff I've got brewin up my sleeve..
Lookin to do an engine swap; transmission rebuild or replace (depending on if a rebuild will do the job or not); possible rear-end mods to support new performance; possible additional frame support if needed.
I contacted support at www.crateenginedepot.com , which is the new site for www.gmpartsdepot.com (thanks Rob for the referral!). I had some questions about some inconsistencies on the site about the suggested carb, and about the tranny/frame. Here's what I got back from them:
So, with that in mind, I researched the TH400 and found very little information on it, personally. I found it used in some Jeeps, but found that it also actually causes a decrease in horsepower.. so, i'unno.
Any info anyone can give on the transmission, I'm all ears. Note that I have a 3-spd Auto in there now. Stock.
And so with some time and reading, I've built this wishlist:
Ok so there are a few things still of concern:
1) what to do w/ the transmission
2) what to do w/ the body.
so,
1)
I know a guy named Carlton.. goes by "Buzzy".. who knows a lot about transmissions. I'm thinking of contacting him for some advice or referrals, or maybe he'll help me out himself. But otherwise, I'll need to know of some place that could do transmission work. i found 3 places off rt97 in westminster that apparently deal in transmissions. 2 are right near WHS and one's near the 97/main st intersection.
2)
I'm going to get a full paint job during/following this whole process.
The paint job might end up being "do-it-yourself" with some help, if it can be done well enough. Otherwise, it doesn't bother me to have it done professionally, despite the added cost.
Also, The three front body panels, composed of the door-to-door front end, the front bumper, and the front spoiler.. I'm thinking of replacing, when I get the car painted. Reason being: the front section still has damage from the accident, the bumper piece doesn't fit like it should (there's at least a 1/4" offset in places) because it seemingly shrunk while off the car for 8 months or so.. and the spoiler has a little bit of damage to it.
Also, the hood will probably need replacing or modification if this engine swap goes through. I might need to get one with a larger cowl, so shit, i mean, there's the whole front half of the car, really.. All of those parts can be painted off the car, which would make prepwork a lot easier...
And the goal here is to keep this full project affordable (lets shoot for $15,000 max, over the next N month's time.. N being however many months this'll take).; and to keep the work away from my dad as much as possible. I'm not trying to do anything secret here, I just don't want to tie up his time with my car anymore.
So.. thoughts?
Ok, so here's some stuff I've got brewin up my sleeve..
Lookin to do an engine swap; transmission rebuild or replace (depending on if a rebuild will do the job or not); possible rear-end mods to support new performance; possible additional frame support if needed.
I contacted support at www.crateenginedepot.com , which is the new site for www.gmpartsdepot.com (thanks Rob for the referral!). I had some questions about some inconsistencies on the site about the suggested carb, and about the tranny/frame. Here's what I got back from them:
Hello,
Thank you for your email.
That is a mis-print and the 850 carb is the recommended one.
12366996
Please follow the link below.
http://www.crateenginedepot.com/store/Carburetor-850-Holley-12366996-P450C0.aspx
We would suggest a TH400 and you may want to take a look at the rear
end. The frame is pretty much the same as the earlier Vettes and some
were factory equipped with the big block. Unless you put some really
sticky tires on it you should be OK.
To more accurately reflect our focus and success, we are changing our
web address to www.CrateEngineDepot.com Watch for the change coming
soon. All personnel, email addresses, and phone numbers remain the
same. Please visit and book mark our new site.
Hope this helps.
Thanks
So, with that in mind, I researched the TH400 and found very little information on it, personally. I found it used in some Jeeps, but found that it also actually causes a decrease in horsepower.. so, i'unno.
Any info anyone can give on the transmission, I'm all ears. Note that I have a 3-spd Auto in there now. Stock.
And so with some time and reading, I've built this wishlist:
-
Click for details
ZZ454 Crate Engine 440 HP with Aluminum Heads 12498777
PRICE: $5,629.00
Big Block Accessory Drive (with out air) 12498741
PRICE: $592.35
OR
Big Block Accessory Drive (with air) 12498733
PRICE: $795.25
Carburetor (850 Holley) 12366996
PRICE: $519.99
H.E.I. Distributor Asm 93440806
PRICE: $189.95
Spark Plug and Wire Loom Kit 12495078
PRICE: $99.53
Starter Asm - Light Weight (14" flywheel) 9000852
PRICE: $247.25
Max Total (Assuming the "With Air" Accessory Drive)
$7,500.
Ok so there are a few things still of concern:
1) what to do w/ the transmission
2) what to do w/ the body.
so,
1)
I know a guy named Carlton.. goes by "Buzzy".. who knows a lot about transmissions. I'm thinking of contacting him for some advice or referrals, or maybe he'll help me out himself. But otherwise, I'll need to know of some place that could do transmission work. i found 3 places off rt97 in westminster that apparently deal in transmissions. 2 are right near WHS and one's near the 97/main st intersection.
2)
I'm going to get a full paint job during/following this whole process.
The paint job might end up being "do-it-yourself" with some help, if it can be done well enough. Otherwise, it doesn't bother me to have it done professionally, despite the added cost.
Also, The three front body panels, composed of the door-to-door front end, the front bumper, and the front spoiler.. I'm thinking of replacing, when I get the car painted. Reason being: the front section still has damage from the accident, the bumper piece doesn't fit like it should (there's at least a 1/4" offset in places) because it seemingly shrunk while off the car for 8 months or so.. and the spoiler has a little bit of damage to it.
Also, the hood will probably need replacing or modification if this engine swap goes through. I might need to get one with a larger cowl, so shit, i mean, there's the whole front half of the car, really.. All of those parts can be painted off the car, which would make prepwork a lot easier...
And the goal here is to keep this full project affordable (lets shoot for $15,000 max, over the next N month's time.. N being however many months this'll take).; and to keep the work away from my dad as much as possible. I'm not trying to do anything secret here, I just don't want to tie up his time with my car anymore.
So.. thoughts?
-THE SURGEON GENERAL WARNING NEVER SAID ANYTHING ABOUT SMOKING A FORD
All I will say here is weekend projects arnt.....
15,000$ seems like a resonalbe goal, however it will turn into alot more when you get down to the nitty gritty of things. For instance look at Mike Keys SS engine swap, talk to him sometime about that. Or anouther one look at Steves 5.0. That was supposed to be a cheap fixer up but It tunred into a ton more.
All I will say Kenny if you can pull this off Mad Props to you, and you will have a bitchen car, just remeber though all the small costs add up...
Jeremy
15,000$ seems like a resonalbe goal, however it will turn into alot more when you get down to the nitty gritty of things. For instance look at Mike Keys SS engine swap, talk to him sometime about that. Or anouther one look at Steves 5.0. That was supposed to be a cheap fixer up but It tunred into a ton more.
All I will say Kenny if you can pull this off Mad Props to you, and you will have a bitchen car, just remeber though all the small costs add up...
Jeremy
Whenever I knowingly delve into a project (unlike having my T/A put away for 7 months...), I always think about what else I can do with that money. $15K is a lot to put into a single vehicle and it Could end up in the cornfield, or worse. Or it may not. Nevertheless, what else could you do with that money???
Maybe get another daily driver sports car? (C4 Vette/convertible, a muscle car that needs TLC, someone else's completed project, etc) With your decision, obviously you will be doing some work to the Vette but not all. You will probably have to pay someone to do somethings to it to make it work; those 'somethings' can add up to a lot of money very fast, more than likely taking you out of budget.
If I put $15K into a project, I would only plan for spending 2/3s of the money ($10K), because the other $5K will end up being spent on unforseen parts/labor/services.
Just my thoughts
Maybe get another daily driver sports car? (C4 Vette/convertible, a muscle car that needs TLC, someone else's completed project, etc) With your decision, obviously you will be doing some work to the Vette but not all. You will probably have to pay someone to do somethings to it to make it work; those 'somethings' can add up to a lot of money very fast, more than likely taking you out of budget.
If I put $15K into a project, I would only plan for spending 2/3s of the money ($10K), because the other $5K will end up being spent on unforseen parts/labor/services.
Just my thoughts
'95 Trans Am (working) & '91 3000GT VR-4 (broken) & '94 3000GT VR-4 (broken)
OK Ken,
I have a few things to say.
First, A Big Block swap into a Small Block car isn't very easy. You will have to relocate or replace your motor mounts with big block ones as this swap will not be a direct bolt up procedure. There will be alot of measuring involved. Alot of big block in big block out to make sure your motor mounts are in the correct position and square.
Second, like said above if you plan to stay under your 15K budget you will be doing alot of this stuff by yourself cuz i can't even imagine how much money it would take to have someone swap in a big block into a car that originally had a small block. When i was pricing around for my motor swap i think the cheapest i was told was about 2500 dollars for a direct bolt in motor.
Third, like you said you will have to put a Turbo 400 trans in to handle the extra HP. you will have to get one of these transmissions that are already beefed up to handle the HP:
http://www.700r4l60e.com/store/customer/product.php?productid=5&cat=17&page=1
http://www.bmracing.com/index.php?id=products&sid=4&cat=4&subcat=16&pid=31
and there are others around you just have to look. that is just what i came up with when i did a little searching. But like what i was saying you'll have to buy a transmission another 800 dollars give or take. Then along with that it says an external Tranny Cooler is recommended there a another few bucks. Plus I'm not sure if a Turbo 400 will mate with your type of rear. You rear is an independent suspension rear. So im not sure that will work. You will have to do some research for that. Who knows you may have to go out and buy a straight axle rear and do so more fabrications to get the new rear to mate up with your shocks, springs, control arms and whatever else. I know you will have to buy another driveshaft or get one custom made for you application $$$.
Fourth, You have to look into what you'll have to do with the suspension as far as mods for it. Im sure it wouldn't be a bad idea to start intalling Poly Bushings for your control arms and other related suspension parts and there again unless you have a press you will have to get someone to press most of those bushings in.
Fifth, Probably a thing that you haven't thought about. Your exhaust will probably not bolt up either. so those side pipes you got. they will be just about junk to this new motor. because the header part will not mate up to a big block. You will have to buy a whole new exhaust system.
And last but not least, Plan on doing alot of FABRICATION. My motor was a "direct replacement motor" and they said it will "fit right in". well that was partially true it did bolt up but there were alot of brackets that needed grinding and cutting to make it work. so when you get your pulley set like you said above make sure that you also purchase a set of brackets that will work also because your small block brackets will NOT work.
NOW with all that said. do you think you could still stay under your 15K dollar budget? I'd say you might be close if you do it all yourself. Plus have you ran any of this by your dad. I know he's a restore it back to original type of guy and doesn't like loud mufflers. not saying that is bad but slapping in a big block isn't exactly a restore it back to original condition type of stuff.
oh yeah and you can never do too much research!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I have a few things to say.
First, A Big Block swap into a Small Block car isn't very easy. You will have to relocate or replace your motor mounts with big block ones as this swap will not be a direct bolt up procedure. There will be alot of measuring involved. Alot of big block in big block out to make sure your motor mounts are in the correct position and square.
Second, like said above if you plan to stay under your 15K budget you will be doing alot of this stuff by yourself cuz i can't even imagine how much money it would take to have someone swap in a big block into a car that originally had a small block. When i was pricing around for my motor swap i think the cheapest i was told was about 2500 dollars for a direct bolt in motor.
Third, like you said you will have to put a Turbo 400 trans in to handle the extra HP. you will have to get one of these transmissions that are already beefed up to handle the HP:
http://www.700r4l60e.com/store/customer/product.php?productid=5&cat=17&page=1
http://www.bmracing.com/index.php?id=products&sid=4&cat=4&subcat=16&pid=31
and there are others around you just have to look. that is just what i came up with when i did a little searching. But like what i was saying you'll have to buy a transmission another 800 dollars give or take. Then along with that it says an external Tranny Cooler is recommended there a another few bucks. Plus I'm not sure if a Turbo 400 will mate with your type of rear. You rear is an independent suspension rear. So im not sure that will work. You will have to do some research for that. Who knows you may have to go out and buy a straight axle rear and do so more fabrications to get the new rear to mate up with your shocks, springs, control arms and whatever else. I know you will have to buy another driveshaft or get one custom made for you application $$$.
Fourth, You have to look into what you'll have to do with the suspension as far as mods for it. Im sure it wouldn't be a bad idea to start intalling Poly Bushings for your control arms and other related suspension parts and there again unless you have a press you will have to get someone to press most of those bushings in.
Fifth, Probably a thing that you haven't thought about. Your exhaust will probably not bolt up either. so those side pipes you got. they will be just about junk to this new motor. because the header part will not mate up to a big block. You will have to buy a whole new exhaust system.
And last but not least, Plan on doing alot of FABRICATION. My motor was a "direct replacement motor" and they said it will "fit right in". well that was partially true it did bolt up but there were alot of brackets that needed grinding and cutting to make it work. so when you get your pulley set like you said above make sure that you also purchase a set of brackets that will work also because your small block brackets will NOT work.
NOW with all that said. do you think you could still stay under your 15K dollar budget? I'd say you might be close if you do it all yourself. Plus have you ran any of this by your dad. I know he's a restore it back to original type of guy and doesn't like loud mufflers. not saying that is bad but slapping in a big block isn't exactly a restore it back to original condition type of stuff.
oh yeah and you can never do too much research!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
87 Monte Carlo SS Burgandy/Burgandy, Crate Vortec 350ci, beefed up 200r4, 15x8 Torq Thrust II's, Richmond 3.73s Posi Rear, Custom Tweed Interior --Under Restoration--
Mike very well put. I was waiting for your imput...
Kenny if it is power you want the best way to get it is like what the above people said, buy a project that is already completed. Or by a c4, parts are probally cheaper and more readily availble. And since it is newer some of the stuff you have to worry about on the 78 wont be as big of an issue like new bushings etc... Kenny I would really think twice about doing this, and do lots of research. And unless you know people who know alot about corvettes plan on running into alot of snags with stuff, also plan for the car being off the road for like a year...
Have you thought about maybe doing a supercharger. If I were you with that car, I would probally get the body work all redon, redo the interior a bit, and slap a supercharger on it. You can probally do all of that for 15,000 and the car would be bitchen...
Jeremy
Kenny if it is power you want the best way to get it is like what the above people said, buy a project that is already completed. Or by a c4, parts are probally cheaper and more readily availble. And since it is newer some of the stuff you have to worry about on the 78 wont be as big of an issue like new bushings etc... Kenny I would really think twice about doing this, and do lots of research. And unless you know people who know alot about corvettes plan on running into alot of snags with stuff, also plan for the car being off the road for like a year...
Have you thought about maybe doing a supercharger. If I were you with that car, I would probally get the body work all redon, redo the interior a bit, and slap a supercharger on it. You can probally do all of that for 15,000 and the car would be bitchen...
Jeremy
No way in hell that stock L-48 will handle a Supercharger without some motor work.
With ALL the above being said... My brother gets himself in enough trouble with the setup he has in the vette right now. No sense spending all that money to add fuel to the fire.
And the second this plan passes by the 'rents, its gonna sink like the Titanic.
If you are really into getting something with a little more power, buy one thats finished. You won't have the time or drive to do it yourself and to sub out all that work you can forget staying within that budget.
A used C5 will set ya back $17-23K... Or even getting a 99-04 Cobra seem like better ideas than sinking that much into an already old car. Just like with my vette and mustang, it needs so many things to "shore up" 25-30 years on the road before you can consider adding all those new components to it. I'd save up for a paint job and a new set of exhaust on your vette Kenny, and call it a day. And practice your cleaning skills on those side pipes and valve covers
With ALL the above being said... My brother gets himself in enough trouble with the setup he has in the vette right now. No sense spending all that money to add fuel to the fire.
And the second this plan passes by the 'rents, its gonna sink like the Titanic.
If you are really into getting something with a little more power, buy one thats finished. You won't have the time or drive to do it yourself and to sub out all that work you can forget staying within that budget.
A used C5 will set ya back $17-23K... Or even getting a 99-04 Cobra seem like better ideas than sinking that much into an already old car. Just like with my vette and mustang, it needs so many things to "shore up" 25-30 years on the road before you can consider adding all those new components to it. I'd save up for a paint job and a new set of exhaust on your vette Kenny, and call it a day. And practice your cleaning skills on those side pipes and valve covers
Hey Kenny,
Projects like that always run over time and over budget. If you don't mind not having your car for a few years you can do it, but its not gonna be an overnight thing. Everytime we tried to do something on mine something else broke that had to be replaced.
If it wasn't for the fact that I had a TON of people helping me on mine it would still be on a million pieces instead of just about done. Even though I did run over 15% over budget from what I thought I would be it would have been at least double if not triple the cost if I didn't have those people to turn to.
Projects like that always run over time and over budget. If you don't mind not having your car for a few years you can do it, but its not gonna be an overnight thing. Everytime we tried to do something on mine something else broke that had to be replaced.
If it wasn't for the fact that I had a TON of people helping me on mine it would still be on a million pieces instead of just about done. Even though I did run over 15% over budget from what I thought I would be it would have been at least double if not triple the cost if I didn't have those people to turn to.
99 Roush Stage III Mustang
91 GT 306
Well, all I'm gonna say for now is that, I think it'll all have to wait anyway, because I'm probably going to have to buy a new daily-driver within the next couple of years or so, so even if I just got all of the body work taken care of, I'd be set back a good bit and I'd like that not to happen if I have to be buying a new car (well, new to me, that is).
And just as an FYI, I don't mind being without my car for an extended period of time, if it's for the greater good
And just as an FYI, I don't mind being without my car for an extended period of time, if it's for the greater good
-THE SURGEON GENERAL WARNING NEVER SAID ANYTHING ABOUT SMOKING A FORD
If you are in no rush to acomplish this then you can always start off and turn it into a bunch of smaller projects. Like first take care of suspension stuff, then body work, then tranny work, rear end work engine ect.... Span it across like 10 years or so... That may be a more realistic goal.. I think it would be neat to see this done, but I think it is gonna be more difficult then you would think..
Jeremy
Jeremy
Well, I finally got some proper identification for my car:
They'll be replacing the L-82 badges on the hood.
They'll be replacing the L-82 badges on the hood.
-THE SURGEON GENERAL WARNING NEVER SAID ANYTHING ABOUT SMOKING A FORD
Those badges are nice!
I think you should get custom plates to match:
STROKTHS
I think you should get custom plates to match:
STROKTHS
— CStingray78Those badges are nice!
I think you should get custom plates to match:
STROKTHS
Actually that wouldnt work a plate can only be 7 charaters, so it would have to be STRKTHS...
Damn MD MVA site sucks it doesnt let you look up availible vantity plates like other states do. Oh well. It be cool none the less..
Jeremy